30 for 30: Once Upon a Time In Queens - IGT

METS LEGIONS

It’s good to be the fantasy drama queen
That Pendleton homer was a significant trauma event in my nine-year old life. Like, 4th in MLB in wins (91) and don't get to go to the playoffs, while
San Francisco (90) and Minnesota (85) do?
If wildcard was around we could legit say they could have gone to every WS from 84 to 90 as NL CHAMPS
 

JPSchmack

HOF'er Who Needs To Retire
Administrator
Think they underplayed the '88 team way too much at the end as well... If not for Orel Hershiser, the Mets are in the WS in '88...
Yeah, they totally made it sound like the Mets were dismantled for the 1987 season. We lost Mitchell and Knight, added McReynolds and David Cone, and swapped out some bench/role/bullpen players -- Magadan for Heep, Innis for Bereyni.

On paper, we had a better team 1987. But Gooden was suspended, Ojeda was hurt, Darling was much worse, and Carter's age caught up with him.
 

therapist

Out on parole
Amazing documentary and it’s the one to end them all. Hopefully this is it, some amazing footage and a few things we haven’t heard before, but largely just a nice packaging of all the good stuff. They also are pulling some punches if you ask me, I wasn’t expecting a full tell all but they def took it easy.
 

DennisCook

Refugee
There's a misleading piece of editing in Game 7... when Carter dinks it to Dwight Evans, and Keith is tagged out, it seems like there were two outs and Keith wasn't running. They show him get out and the inning is over.
 

mec8644

Registered User
I'm much more of a lurker here but I do feel the need to comment on a topic like this......I was skeptical of the documentary, only because so many stories and features have been done on the team that I didn't think there was much left to do. But I was plesantly surprised at how much I enjoyed it.

I'm lucky enough to have a large collection of over a thousand of the regular season broadcasts from Mets games of the 80's (90's too), so I probably still feel the connection to that team today, more than most since I still watch this stuff on a semi-regular basis.

I've always disagreed with the prevailing though that not retaining Ray Knight was a huge reason why they never won again. While he was a huge part of the title, that was the last possible drop of good baseball he had left. He was literally one of the worst players in the league over the next 2 years and we replaced him with a star. No amount of grit or whatever the players want to call it will help when your OPSing .600 at a corner position, while your replacment is going 30-30 with power and speed.

The 1987 and 1988 Mets were just as talented as the 86 team, they just didn't have the same amount of breaks that teams need to go all the way. The 87 team was destroyed with pitching injuries and Gooden's suspension and the 88 team was incredibly dominant (in a stronger National League than 86 was too)....they lost Ojeda in the last 10 days of the regular season, which hurt a lot more than people realize. Ojeda was fantastic in 88. It basically came down to the fact that random shit happens in a short 7 game series, and sometimes the best team just doesn't win. The Mets have benefited from that fact too over the years (1973, 2000).
 
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dptydwg420

Not to be confused with BlazeKing420
Moderator
Yeah, that was another place I thought they chopped down for time. They showed a clip of Straw preaching as B-Roll, but didn't dig into having Straw look back at the relationship they had then with Carter and how they view it now.
yup. seemed like the keith familial connection was what they went with, and overdid it a little probly.
 

JPSchmack

HOF'er Who Needs To Retire
Administrator
There was also a lot less Ron Darling than I anticipated. But probably because Ron and Keith can't talk as freely as Lenny can, as they have broadcasting jobs (I'm guessing Teufel wasn't in it for the same reason).
 

METS LEGIONS

It’s good to be the fantasy drama queen
There was also a lot less Ron Darling than I anticipated. But probably because Ron and Keith can't talk as freely as Lenny can, as they have broadcasting jobs (I'm guessing Teufel wasn't in it for the same reason).
Teufel doesnt work for mets anymore?
 

Willie777

Singing Country Music for God and America
Seeing these games from 1986, I can't help but feel it was for the price of maybe never winning again. It kinda makes you understand why everyone still talks about that year... it's just too crazy to get over.
Maybe, maybe not...the Mets should have won in 06 and 2015...they just pissed out right before the finish line.
 
About 95% of the documentary was stuff i already knew from reading The Bad Guys Won book but it still was entertaining and great job with the music and feel bringing you back to the 80s. Stuff i learned:
  • I knew Hernandez' father was tough on him and constantly coaching him, but didn't know it was that extreme that he was on the clubhouse phone with his father in between innings
  • Clemens going into the clubhouse late in Game 6 to shave for the anticipated photos in the celebration
  • Jay Horwitz rejecting the woman of the night because his knee hurt
  • Fans were on the field in fair territory before the final out was even recorded when they won the division
  • Gary Carter putting his catcher gear back on after scoring a run and the team still trailing by a run in the 10th. I never noticed before then that in the celebration at the plate with Ray Knight he's wearing his catcher's gear.
  • I never knew Ojeda was as hurt as he was and yet still went out there and pitched his guts out.
Overall, the documentary made me sad to think that I might never get to experience anything like that as a fan for any of my teams (i was a toddler in '86). Billy Joel's Times to Remember was the perfect song to play at the end when they won the World Series. There's nothing that compares to a baseball team winning a title after a 162-game season. Following a team every day for 7 months through all the ups and downs and seeing it pay off with pure joy for a city. I hope we get to see it again some day in the near future.
 

metzol

My helmet brings all the boys to MR
There's a misleading piece of editing in Game 7... when Carter dinks it to Dwight Evans, and Keith is tagged out, it seems like there were two outs and Keith wasn't running. They show him get out and the inning is over.
Yep, Keith wasn’t running because Evans sort of trapped the ball and it looked like he maybe caught it and the ump took a long time making the call. That’s why he wasn’t running. That was a big play. Killed the rally. Though it was moot afterwards.
 

dptydwg420

Not to be confused with BlazeKing420
Moderator
The fans coming on the field so aggressively was definitely wild.
Some good footage
 

JPSchmack

HOF'er Who Needs To Retire
Administrator
Teufel doesnt work for mets anymore?
I'm pretty sure he does, he's just not on the MLB staff. He's a minor league instructor, last I knew.

The point is, if you want to have a career in coaching, it's probably not the best idea to go on national TV and talk about your bar fights and crazy shit.

Like, Straw can say anything they want, because Straw has taken ownership of everything he did and uses that in his ministry. Lenny and Wally can say whatever the fuck they want, because MLB baseball is done with them (Wally's coaching the Ducks because him being an 86 Met IS THE DRAW, his MLB chances ended with DUIs and rants and shit).
 

AllWrightNow

Refugee
Let me just say that lenny was absolutely fucking amazing in documentary I want the directors cut with more footage.
I believe they go farther with team dismantling by showing Pendleton homer in 87 but cut it out for the ending they settled on
Russo had the director on SiriusXM and he said his rough cut was over six hours(!) but ESPN ultimately shortened it so he had to leave a lot of stuff out.
 

JPSchmack

HOF'er Who Needs To Retire
Administrator
Yep, Keith wasn’t running because Evans sort of trapped the ball and it looked like he maybe caught it and the ump took a long time making the call. That’s why he wasn’t running. That was a big play. Killed the rally. Though it was moot afterwards.
Yup. His reaction to being out is chewing out the ump. He was pissed he got trapped. Ultimately, he did the right thing -- he can't get doubled off in that spot. If it's a Fielder's Choice, so be it.

Which proves the point of "that wasn't the last out of the inning." If there were 2 outs, Keith Hernandez in a World Series game would have been almost to third by the time the ball was visible and depending on where he was, he could have scored on the play.
 

therapist

Out on parole
Oof the old lady reporter saying I don’t think they could get away with trashing a plane after winning the nlcs if they weren’t winning

nah you think?

Pretty much everything this lady has said has been awful.

Just couldn’t resist shoehorning some “something from 35 years ago wouldn’t fly today” woke nonsense.
 

METS LEGIONS

It’s good to be the fantasy drama queen
Oof the old lady reporter saying I don’t think they could get away with trashing a plane after winning the nlcs if they weren’t winning

nah you think?

Pretty much everything this lady has said has been awful.
She worked on wfan I also think Foster was banging her on side
 

Funky Boobster

Still Strokes His Mom's Pussy
That female reporter was Ann Ligori. She still does the occasional golf updates for WFAN. Maybe she used to cover baseball? I dunno. I only know her to cover golf. Strange person to interview for baseball.

And if there’s a few more hours of material remaining, they should include that in a BluRay edition. I’ll buy this regardless, but director’s cut with boat loads of extra footage would give me 🍆
 
That female reporter was Ann Ligori. She still does the occasional golf updates for WFAN. Maybe she used to cover baseball? I dunno. I only know her to cover golf. Strange person to interview for baseball.

And if there’s a few more hours of material remaining, they should include that in a BluRay edition. I’ll buy this regardless, but director’s cut with boat loads of extra footage would give me 🍆
Holy shit, I saw her on there and had no idea why the hell she got in this.

She might even occasionally still do a show here and there on WFAN. Always found her kind of grating.
 

Funky Boobster

Still Strokes His Mom's Pussy
88 team was a powerhouse. They may not have had the same clubhouse chemistry as 86, but their offense was more potent. Starting pitching was a bit weaker, but pen was stronger. You could argue that overall talent was stronger than 86. Hershiser was our kryptonite. He was worse than Scott. That motherfucker had an all time great postseason. God level.
 

METS LEGIONS

It’s good to be the fantasy drama queen
88 team was a powerhouse. They may not have had the same clubhouse chemistry as 86, but their offense was more potent. Starting pitching was a bit weaker, but pen was stronger. You could argue that overall talent was stronger than 86. Hershiser was our kryptonite. He was worse than Scott. That motherfucker had an all time great postseason. God level.
Doc giving up that hr in 10th inning to fatty mike was the series win that game and series is over and bulldog can suck a dick
 

Knight Ray

Refugee
Doc giving up that hr in 10th inning to fatty mike was the series win that game and series is over and bulldog can suck a dick
That Scoscia HR was a crushing blow. One of the worst losses of all the teams I followed.
I hated him forever after managing those Angles teams
 

Funky Boobster

Still Strokes His Mom's Pussy
Yeah Scioscia had zero power. Dude averaged like 3 home runs per season. That was the last guy you give up a dinger to. Gibson also played like a HOFer. Ridiculous catches and clutch home runs. We crushed that team in the regular season, and they tore our hearts out in the NLCS.
 

mec8644

Registered User
The Scioscia homer killed. Later in that game in the 11th, after Gibson had homered to give the dodgers the lead, the Mets loaded the bases with 1 out and had Straw and McReynolds up.....Straw hit an infield pop up and then Lasorda brought in Hershiser to pitch to McReynolds and he almost blooped in the game winning single but the ball hung up just long enough to catch......Just a nightmare loss on every level
 
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