POBO Thread | Hey Arnold!

JPSchmack

HOF'er Who Needs To Retire
Administrator
I hear what you guys are trying to say, and I think it's pretty silly and irrelevant. Beane especially.

A Tampa guy shows up to New York and goes ham on free agents because he finally CAN.... yeah, that's actually a legit concern. Because we know Beane and the Neander are making their moves out of necessity, and we don't know what Neader's untethered philosophy IS. But at the same time, these guys didn't lead small budget clubs to great seasons repeatedly because they're dumb.

With Beane, we know his M.O. -- it's about VALUE. Assessing the true value of baseball players lets him exploit the market. When the goal changes from "build the best team you can for $90 million" to "build the best team you can for $200 million" VERY LITTLE is going to change for Beane in terms of HOW HE VALUES guys.

If he can find value to pick the very best cheap players, what makes people think he's going to struggle identifying the young, elite FAs and signing them if they are worth it? Just because he shops in the bargain bin all the time, he doesn't know how to assess the value of Mike Trout and Carlos Correa? That's nuts.

The smart guys minimize risk, and the elite FA shopping almost never hurts you, provided you're signing age-appropriate guys (Lindor, Machado, Harper). It's the SECOND TIER guys who have huge risk. Signing a 31-year old to a $23 million contract that kills you. Like Cano, or Chris Davis.
 
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Bobbyv13

Veteran Refugee
I would be very happy with Byrnes, but lets be honest he wasn’t a stud in Arizona and San Diego when he was in charge. Beane is still my choice but part of that is that I don’t think there is any chance for Stearns. Perfect world for me is Beane POBO, Byrnes GM.

Side note, I think people are too focused on how we win. If they win, I don’t give a shit if they do it with the biggest budget in the game or one of the lowest.
 

JPSchmack

HOF'er Who Needs To Retire
Administrator
I would be very happy with Byrnes, but lets be honest he wasn’t a stud in Arizona and San Diego when he was in charge.
He won two divisions with a lower third payroll in Arizona, and drafted Scherzer, Goldschmidt, Pollock, and Eaton.


The D'Backs ownership has been like the Mets under Wilpon and the Angels under Moreno: They don't ever want to rebuild, and they never go all-in either. Like the 2015 D'Backs went from 63 to 78 wins... so they traded Didi Gregorious for Robbie Ray, and signed Greinke.... and also traded Swanson and Inciarte for Shelby Miller. You trade BOTH SS and you have to put Nick Ahmed, who can't hit, as your starter and then your offense sucks?

Then they deal Greinke to Houston after 2.5 years because their roster isn't good enough to compete and justify the expense... and they PAY $24 million to Houston to facilitate the deal.... and just turn around and give $17 million per season for five years to Bumgarner??

I don't know why a GM would do that unless their owner is giving them dumb orders.
 

Daaaarryyl

Registered User
I think those Arizona trades (like for Shelby Miller) where made by Dave Stewart.


Former pitcher turned agent and then getting the GM job in Arizona before he was mercilessly let go.


And RE: bringing in a small market GM without much history wrt $$$


Remember Kevin Malone, architect of the famous/infamous 1994 Montreal Expos.

An absolutely stacked roster put together on pennies and dimes, Malone was given the keys to the Dodgers a few years later and was the "New sheriff in town".


With money to burn and a build a winner now philosophy Malone was a fish out of water pulling in big names and spending a fortune building the mediocre Dodgers teams of the early 2000's.
 

JPSchmack

HOF'er Who Needs To Retire
Administrator
I think those Arizona trades (like for Shelby Miller) where made by Dave Stewart.
Right, Byrnes wasn't make stupid trades with the D'Backs...

I'm saying the D'Backs have had the same owner since 2004, and the only time in their history they've ever gone "All-in" was at the start of the franchise to win in 2001, and they backloaded and deferred all those contracts from that era. Then the dude sold the team. With all those deferred contracts, Byrnes was the guy who made them GOOD and CHEAP at the same time. And ever since he left, the DBacks have just done stupid shit, not committing to a plan or a direction.

They've never rebuilt. Even when they dealt Goldschmidt and Greinke, they didn't deal EVERYONE for as many prospects as they could get... and turned around and signed Bumgarner for no reason!

That type of stupidity cannot infect three GMs in a row. I know literally nothing about the DBack's owner. I'm just saying it wouldn't surprise me if HE also happened to have a meddlesome incompetent son named Jeff.
 

ciarlatano

Refugee
He won two divisions with a lower third payroll in Arizona, and drafted Scherzer, Goldschmidt, Pollock, and Eaton.


The D'Backs ownership has been like the Mets under Wilpon and the Angels under Moreno: They don't ever want to rebuild, and they never go all-in either. Like the 2015 D'Backs went from 63 to 78 wins... so they traded Didi Gregorious for Robbie Ray, and signed Greinke.... and also traded Swanson and Inciarte for Shelby Miller. You trade BOTH SS and you have to put Nick Ahmed, who can't hit, as your starter and then your offense sucks?

Then they deal Greinke to Houston after 2.5 years because their roster isn't good enough to compete and justify the expense... and they PAY $24 million to Houston to facilitate the deal.... and just turn around and give $17 million per season for five years to Bumgarner??

I don't know why a GM would do that unless their owner is giving them dumb orders.
Yes, trading both SS was not a great idea, especially Swanson who had potential at that point. But, the offensive drop from Didi to Ahmed was essentially non-existent that time. Didi couldn't got a lick until he started juicing a couple of years into his Yankee stint.
 

amazin port

Refugee
Dont look at the names (Neander, Byrnes, Stearns or Beane) it's the philosophies that matters.

None of those four have had ultimate responsibility for a $200m+ (top 4 spending organisation) and each will have a different method of assessing value and talent.

I would of thought at interview each would have to outline an overall plan based on hypothetically approximate payrolls and organisational emphasis.....whoever's ideas align closer with those of Cohen/Alderson ,or is able to convince them of their ideas, wins (and hopefully accepts) the post.
 

JPSchmack

HOF'er Who Needs To Retire
Administrator
Yes, trading both SS was not a great idea, especially Swanson who had potential at that point. But, the offensive drop from Didi to Ahmed was essentially non-existent that time. Didi couldn't got a lick until he started juicing a couple of years into his Yankee stint.
I don't think you realize who Nick Ahmed is. Didi had a 98 OPS+ for the DBacks the year before he was traded. Ahmed had a 40 OPS+ that year as a rookie. His first five years, he had a 69 OPS+ His career OBP is .002 higher than Rey Ordonez.
 

ciarlatano

Refugee
I don't think you realize who Nick Ahmed is. Didi had a 98 OPS+ for the DBacks the year before he was traded. Ahmed had a 40 OPS+ that year as a rookie. His first five years, he had a 69 OPS+ His career OBP is .002 higher than Rey Ordonez.
You misread the columns. Didi had 98 total bases that year, his OPS+ was 81. Didi sucked until he got that old "pinstripe magic" into his veins.

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JPSchmack

HOF'er Who Needs To Retire
Administrator
You misread the columns. Didi had 98 total bases that year, his OPS+ was 81. Didi sucked until he got that old "pinstripe magic" into his veins.
Oh, I did. You're right. Fuck. Pre-coffee on the West Coast.

But again, an 81 OPS+ for Didi... Ahmed went 40-69-46-79-83 his first five years. And the Didi trade was actually a GOOD TRADE. Robbie Ray was good for them.

I'm saying with the the team that Byrnes built, The DBacks would have been a great team to launch franchise mode with back then, because you could turn that team into a power pretty easily. And they just kept fucking it up
 

ciarlatano

Refugee
Oh, I did. You're right. Fuck. Pre-coffee on the West Coast.

But again, an 81 OPS+ for Didi... Ahmed went 40-69-46-79-83 his first five years. And the Didi trade was actually a GOOD TRADE. Robbie Ray was good for them.

I'm saying with the the team that Byrnes built, The DBacks would have been a great team to launch franchise mode with back then, because you could turn that team into a power pretty easily. And they just kept fucking it up
The Didi trade was a great trade for them. It was a stupendous trade for them. Trading Swanson was the mistake, followed by a lot more mistakes.

Either way, Didi sucked, and probably would have continued his regression right to Ahmed level without the roids "change of scenery".
 

BennySammy

Parents should have arranged for deodorant instead
Moderator
as a former troll myself, I can appreciate the effort to annoy as many people as possible with just one post

but even with that effort, at least be accurate...this is not Mets news...this guy is a chef at a restaurant at Citi Field...it's not Mets news...it's Citi Field news
 

Hire

Veteran Refugee
Administrator
as a former troll myself, I can appreciate the effort to annoy as many people as possible with just one post

but even with that effort, at least be accurate...this is not Mets news...this guy is a chef at a restaurant at Citi Field...it's not Mets news...it's Citi Field news
I was waiting for him to post your Bugs Bunny gif after

 

nexxt

The Ultimate Contrarian
Unless they’re waiting on Byrnes (which really shouldn’t matter if they’re still playing because he’s not GM or POBO anyway), then they need to get a move on things here.
Sounds like they’re not doing anything until the season concludes. they seem interested in doing all the interviews around the same time. Gonna have to be patient.
 
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